I know many of you are waiting for news about the "surprise". Well, finally, I have some news. The short answer is that it has been determined that it is not appropriate for me to put up the page in its current form. For those who didn't see it originally on the "teaser" day, the "surprise" is actually a collection of just over 100 photographs, taken by forum member Frédérick Bastien. The photos are of the setups of each of the 10 displays from the 2004 competition. They cover all of the firing ramps from many different angles and Frédérick took advantage of the large Ferris wheel to take many of the pictures. Thus it is possible to compare and contrast each of the displays.

Now, as to why it is not appropriate to put up this page of pictures. First of all, I did not seek the permission of each of the display companies. Since the physical setup of their display can be thought of as proprietary (just as much as the script used) it might be something that they don't want to directly disclose. I could contact each of the companies and ask for permission, but without the permission of all of them, it would make little sense to have only some of the photographs.

Now, it could be argued that anyone who goes to La Ronde can see for themselves the setups used. But that is the point. A prospective competitor has to make the effort to go to Montreal in person to see how things are done. And it is unlikely (though not impossible) that someone would come and see the whole competition. By putting the photographs up on this site, it could be argued that it makes it too easy for prospective competitors, though the detail in the photographs is not so clear.

I realize some forum members missed the opportunity to see the photos. Therefore I will put them up for one more day, again for members only. This time, there will be plenty of advance notice: "setup special" day will be Monday 4th October from 12:00am until midnight EDT. As before, only members will be able to see them. Also, don't bother bookmarking the link when it is revealed since it will be removed afterwards.

Feel free to discuss what you see on that day (please, not before) but remember that no-one but members will be able to see the pictures.

Cheers,

Paul.

Paul,

Wasn't there another bigger surprise, or is this the one you were talking about the whole time?

Regards,

Trav.

I am feeling very disappointed to learn that Paul did not get a permission to put these pictures on his website, with a free access for everyone interested by fireworks in general and Le Mondial SAQ in particular. I have suspected this conclusion since I was informed that some disagreements occured at La Ronde about Paul's request.

In my opinion, La Ronde's rationale, as exposed by Paul, is rather weak. First, from a fanatic viewpoint, the photos do not appear clear and detailed enough to deduce significant technical information.

Second, everyone who has the habit to go near the ramps before a display knows that the setup does not inform about the quality of the show, and less about many features of the display (sound track, synchro, combinations, sequences...). On this point, the short videoclips edited by La Ronde and available on Le Mondial SAQ's website can be more informative.

Third, some prospective competitors can see many more displays than others: I am sure that it is very easy for a Canadian recrue to see the whole competition. And it can be the same thing for an American competitor who lives near the border. In this context, it could be argued that these pictures contribute to reduce the gap between prospective competitors. In the future, broadcasting the entire displays could have the same positive effect.

Fourth, I am sure that the world of firework is a small one. For many prospective competitors or other persons interested by these displays, it should not be difficult to find a person and to give him the mandate to capture pictures or a video of all displays.

For all these points, I think that La Ronde's rationale is rather weak.

Finally, I want to say "Thank You" to Paul. He has performed a very good job to edit my pictures. It is a great pity that this work can not be put online now. Maybe that it will be easier to release this kind of material when the Montreal International Fireworks Competition will be vanished. This kind of decisions from La Ronde, which discourage the fanatics to talk and exchange about it, should contribute to the end of this wonderful event.

Frédérick

I have to correct a mistake in the last sentence of my text. We should read that this kind of decisions "CAN contribute to the end of this wonderful event".

Frédérick

Frederick,

I totally agree. Why shouldn't those pictures be allowed to be posted here on this site? Look at all the other sources where people can actually view setup! Sheeesh!

In any case, I was actually really hoping that we could make some serious discussions about this surprise! As you say, La Ronde's reasoning is very weak, indeed!

As for the competition vanishing, I don't want to talk about that! That REALLY turns me off! I can't stand it! Why would someone want to be dumb enought to cancel this competition!?! It's absurd! I know we went through this before with all that corporate business and park expansions dilemma, but still!

I think we should protest! There's got to be something we can do!

Really, who would be stupid enough to VANISH the world's biggest fireworks competition!? I don't see the logic behind that context.

Regards,

Trav.

Just to be clear, La Ronde did not tell me that I could or could not put the pictures up on my site. We had a discussion and various opinions were presented, but it was always clear that I am free to do what I want with this site, so long as I abide by all the usual copyright and privacy rules.

Since it was felt that each setup "belonged" to the company putting on the display, just as the script used does, it did not seem appropriate to put up the photographs without at least asking the permission of each of the display companies. Even though it is not really possible to tell the quality of a display by looking at the photographs of the setups, there would, inevitably, be a discussion about "who had the biggest setup". In fact, we have already had that discussion to an extent. People who are knowledgeable in the world of fireworks might understand that there is much more to judging a display quality than looking at how many candles, mortars etc. there are on site, but not everyone has that skill or knowledge.

I do hope to get the permission of each of the display companies so that I can put up the photographs clear in the knowledge that there are no objections. This may take some time though. To be honest, in the past, some companies have not allowed me to look at their site setup "bible" since it contained, in their minds, proprietary information. On the other hand, some companies have given me access to all the site drawings and even the full script used.

Please be patient and I'll see if I can get permission from everyone. In the meantime, make sure you take advantage of the one day special next week.

Finally, please don't blame the people at La Ronde. I sought their permission out of politeness - there was no legal obligation to do this - and we had some very interesting discussions about the subject. As the result of the discussions, I decided that it would be best to defer posting the photographs (despite having worked for many hours editting and formatting them) until I had the clear permission of all the interested parties.

Paul.

Paul, as Smoke said, was this the big surprise?

It was a component of it. I'm still working on some other parts. Please bear with me.

Paul.

Patience is a virtue!

All I have to say is that this surprise must be big if you're working that hard on it!

Maybe I should be guessing what it is. I know for sure that it isn't about next year's schedule, that's January.

Trav.

Following Paul's message, I have to retract since it is clear that La Ronde did not forbid diffusion of these pictures. To the persons at La Ronde involved in this debate, I wish to apologize for my criticism: you are not concerned. Of course, because Paul is in charge of this website, he is free to decide what he should post and what he should not. Anyway, since he has spent a lot of time to edit these pictures, I am confident that he has good reasons.

However, I think that my four arguments are strong. It is possible that they can be addressed to recalcitrant companies. I understand that the script of a display can be considered as a confidential information: it is a written document and it includes technical and detailed data. I argue that it is not the same thing about the setup: everyone can examine the full setup from many points of view around the lake. In addition, all pictures that I captured last summer have been taken from "public" points of view: I did not have a special access to the ramps for that.

I hope that many fanatics will take advantage of the one day special next week.

Again, Paul, thank you for all your work!

Frédérick

As promised, forum members have access to the photos again for one day. If you're a member, you'll see where to click, if not, you won't. Enjoy while you can.

Paul.

Paul,

Although I've seen them on the day you posted it for members only already, I would love to see them a second time! Thx.

Just one question. Will we ever get the chance to discuss it with other members? I can see that this has a very big potential for discussion stimulation! It will generate a lot of posts!

Don't get me wrong, though. I know you've got to get permission from all the firms first. Well, any luck getting through?

And another thing, I just wanted to let you know that a video forum would be a great idea, which you proposed a few weeks ago. It's relevant since we've been getting excessive video clips from many people, including you! It would be approprioate.

Regards,

Trav.

It's going to take some time to sort out, same for the video forum. I think what I'll do is just make the downloads available for forum members - after all, there has to be some special benefit of membership!

Paul.

Of course. It does feel beneficial to be a member!

Regards,

Trav.

Wow, got way more than I bargained for by stirring up the 'surprise' pot. My poor little dial-up modem is getting quite a workout. Thanx, Paul.

Next question: You mentioned a while ago that La Ronde might be working on a 'best of' video. Is it still on? Any updates?

Cheers to all